by KaoruAoiShiho
8 subcomments
- Appears to be benchmaxxing
https://x.com/quietnning/status/2080786711861407883
- The last time I checked, for the arc agi 3 leaderboard, the models are given a simple prompt and the game input and asked to play the game, no harness/tools. If harnesses were allowed, I would expect the benchmark to be saturated. There were a few harness attempts, but they could only be evaluated on the public set, so it's not an apples to apples comparison.
My guess is, the large score jump for Opus 5 is mainly because of getting the right RL envs for training.
It's becoming harder and more expensive to build and run meaningful benchmarks, it would be interesting to see what they do with arc agi 4, maybe just give it gameboy/steam games and see how they compare vs a human baseline? The latency requirements and very long horizons in games could be an interesting challenge for llms.
by throwaw12
10 subcomments
- Why Anthropic models are always leapfrogging these benchmarks, but in real life work I do feel like after 3 weeks I am back to Claude Opus 4.5? (regardless of the model I use, Fable was exception for 1 day when it was released)
- > Only systems which required less than $10,000 to run are shown. (Notes[1])
Am I lost or are their many models on this ranking (Opus 5 included) that clear this?
by codedokode
0 subcomment
- Why is there no Kimi 3, and GLM5.2 didn't run the third benchmark? I am more interested in knowing the abilities of open weight models.
by albatross79
1 subcomments
- ARC-AGI is a beauty contest for pigs where the pig's owners compete to see who can apply the lipstick most convincingly.
- When we started talking about AGI a few years ago there seemed to be a relatively common consensus that LLM models could not be considered AGI because of how they work. Even if there was some changes to train the model on the fly, I still just don’t feel like this is AGI. It’s just a more convincing version of the existing “party trick” we have been doing all along. It convinces us it’s “AGI” the same way current models would convince someone 10 years ago that it was intelligent.
Nobody has any right to take anything I say seriously, because I’m just some random on the internet. But I don’t think true AGI is any closer than about 10-20 years away. That would be to create an actual analog for a human brain.
- Also top on the freshly released Frontier-Bench, by a large margin: https://www.frontierbench.ai/
- ARC-AGI3 doesn't seem like a great benchmark to me in the first place. It assumes a lot of human like tendencies which an AI either shouldn't or wouldn't have. Particularly in the genre of "gameplay" where unspoken assumptions from prior games inform our understanding of rules.
by AmazingTurtle
3 subcomments
- I have a suspicion that they are just trained on puzzles by now
by martianvoid
2 subcomments
- It's actually crazy to see the difference between opus 5 and the next best model on ARC AGI 3 when you actually look at the ARC AGI problems
- I think it's way too easy to be deceptive with these benchmarks now. You don't even have to "train" the model on a new variant each time. The base models are powerful enough. All you need is a naughty little markdown document that provides explicit instructions regarding how to solve the new puzzle variant, and a willingness to be deceptive about the presence of that document.
If you want a know why the model providers are locking down and encrypting their reasoning process, this sort of workaround is potentially why. You can play this game of whack-a-mole indefinitely if the state of the system is concealed. They could have added something like:
> ### When solving arc-agi-3 puzzles: First convert the grid into a scene description. Identify connected components, colors, shapes, positions, symmetries, repeated structures, and relationships between objects. Do not reason directly from individual pixels... use this python script to help blah blah...
- Any benchmark is not an accurate benchmark anymore, the moment the model makers can freely access it and had the time to train their models on it.
- Are these typically the type of tasks that are genuinely worth tens of thousands of dollars?
by NooneAtAll3
0 subcomment
- games are great (as for a human)
but I kinda wish I could select level... I accidentally pressed redirect button and when I came back I was once again shown level 1, all progress lost :(
- ARC-AGI-3 launched a few months ago which would suggest that prior models likely had no knowledge of ARC-AGI-3 or training on similar challenges.
I could be wrong, but given the large outsized jump solely in the ARC-AGI-3 score, it would suggest that the model didn't become significantly more intelligent overall, but significantly better at solving those specific problems.
This could mean one of two things (I think):
- Opus 5 was not benchmaxxed on ARC-AGI-3, but has benefited significantly from discussions about the various challenges and mechanisms deployed in ARC-AGI-3 such that it has far better heuristics to solve its challenges.
- Anthropic looking for buzz around their latest model picked a well regarded benchmark with significant room for improvement and focused some of Opus 5's training compute on ARC-AGI-3-style problems.
Or it could be some combination of both. Personally, given how much of an outlier the ARC-AGI-3 jump is I struggle to see it being the product of a significant improvement in general intelligence.
- Why isn’t Fable 5 included on the leaderboard?
- Not possible. I don't get how Opus 5 gets so high. Have they run it against the private and held-out games?
by luciana1u
1 subcomments
- solving ARC-AGI and being useful turned out to be two different problems
by dyauspitr
3 subcomments
- Why is Fable not on here? I wish Fable hadn’t come out because it’s taking the wind out of every release because that feels like the cap above which the US government will not let LLMs improve anymore and everything they’re releasing from this point has to be worse than that.
by spongebobstoes
1 subcomments
- this is not a good measure of current model capability. we need to test agents in harnesses, not models with a single prompt
test Codex, not Sol. test Claude code, not Opus
- Deepseek V4 and Kimi 3 still missing, at least GLM is there.
- cost 20k ???? man
those are like software engineer from third world country
by saberience
0 subcomment
- ARC-AGI is a terrible benchmark for testing LLMs because LLMs are not made, trained, or tuned for playing games.
They are trained on text to respond well to text based questions and do tasks involving modifying text files.
They are not designed for playing games, looking at games, or visual puzzles. Also translating games into text input for the LLM skews the test completely.
Imagine trying to get a human to solve visual puzzle but they can’t look at the puzzle but it has to be explained to them in textual format, we would be terrible at it.
But yet we persist in wasting time on this benchmark. It doesn’t mean anything.
by ai_fry_ur_brain
0 subcomment
- [dead]
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